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Forum posts for How do we save the World?

You're right Paul.
Posted by mike on Dec 17, 2003
Paul, you are right about all of your points that you are going to not do. You are right to not do them, and you are right that it is very easy to not do something that you already don't do.

I don't eat veal. Not only because of the conditions in which they are raised, but because of the horrible amount of chemicals and hormones that you would ingest by eating veal. Remember: if you inject a cow with anthrax (I know that is silly, but I am using it to prove a point), and you kill the cow and eat it, you just ate beef AND anthrax. Just because you kill the animal doesn't negate the crap that you fed it or gave it. It is the same way that mercury and lead (and other stuff) end up all over the environment, via the food chain.
It doesn't bother me in the least to kill things, as long as there is a good reason. By eating any meat product it obviously doesn't bother you either. Obviously torture is a different story. If you are going to butcher a cow or whatever then make sure you do it right, the cow was nice enough to feed you (although it was probably under the impression that it was the other way around), so you could at least be nice enough to kill it humanely. Although that would require a definition of humanely which I will not be giving. A common misconception about what happens at an abatoir or whatever they call other killing places is that because the animal is flopping around for a bit after they kill it that it is still alive and was inhumanely killed. EVERYTHING has the potential to flop around like that after it has died, the brain still has some left over energy that get randomly distributed to the muscles after death. Movies have really warped peoples conception of a lot of things I think. Obviosly, as with all things, there are exceptions. I am sure that some places don't get a clean kill and therefore are a bunch of pricks.

SUV's are the worst invention in the automobile industry in recent times. Not only do they guzzle gas and so forth, they have no practical purpose to them that is not better served by another type of vehicle (carrying stuff = cargo van or truck, people moving = passenger van). I think the only reason that they have become so popular is that they give people a false (and I mean DANGEROUSLY FALSE) sense of security, safety, and power when they drive. That is how they have been promoted I believe. Everyone has them, and they have also become a status symbol.
Trucks are a completely different story. Trucks serve a practical puepose that is not better served by any other form of vehicle. Please don't give me a bunch of jive about fuel economy (no wait, do it so I can shoot it down and not have to type my reasoning at this time), there is always room for improvement, nothing is perfect.

You had another point, but I can't remember what it is and I don't want to loose all of this typing by hitting back.

Anyway, why not pick some other stuff (as you pointed out yourself):
-no littering
-drive the MOST efficient car on the planet
-give all of your money to some deserving cause
-don't burn anything
-don't eat anything that has exploited something or someone else
-stop wearing clothes
-make all of your stuff yourself from readily available materials like hair and toe lint (industry pollutes)
-don't salt the roads
-don't use plastics, rubbers, or oil based products
-stop wearing fragrances, styling your hair using any kind of product whatsoever.
-no more soap or shampoo (trust me, it pollutes)

Essentially don't do anything that is easy or convenience based. DO NOT be part of society.

Actually in all seriousness the only suggestion that I have heard that would make a difference if employed on a large scale would be: to live self sufficient. That is to get all of your food and supplies through your own labour, that way you know what happened to get the product and can ensure that it was done "properly".

Civilized Motto: (in my opinion)
We should all do our part to improve life on this planet... except when it's inconvenient... or if I have to actually do something.

less crazy
Posted by cosmicfish on Dec 17, 2003
can't people use sand instead of salt? i know it doesn't melt the ice but it provides traction and doesn't attract poor little forest creatures to the road.

to stop wearing clothes would be okay, except we live in canada, in the snow.

some year i will live totally self sufficient. i will write about it and let you all know how it goes.

Poor Goderich.
Posted by mike on Dec 17, 2003
A lot of municipalities right here in Ontario are exploring alternatives to salt. The only problem with that is the alternative (seemingly as always) involves a bunch of chemicals.

Also (feel free to call me on this if you are some kind of expert) I believe that salt is only useful for certain applications. For instance in Alberta I don't think they use salt at all. That is why their cars last longer (so they say). I think the reasoning is that salt only works under certain temperature conditions. If it is too cold then the salt doesn't really help. If it is too warm there is no ice so their is no point . I think northern Ontario steers clear of salt for the most part, but I am not willing to call that a fact.

I didn't really think so much of the animals in particular, I was thinking aobut the environment as a whole. Have you ever heard the expression of "Burn it down and salt the earth."? Salt makes plants not grow, at least most plants don't enjoy it. Probably why the roadside plants are always little scrubby sad looking wretches. Someone who knows horticulture stuff is probably aware of this kind of stuff.

If they were truly worried about the animals coming to roads for salt, which I doubt they are (they = government in this case) even though it is a horrible and preventable problem, they would hire two people with a truck to tour around and huck salt licks as far from the road as possible, thereby alleviating some of the problem.

Things I forgot to mention
Posted by phduffy on Dec 17, 2003
I did this late, and forgot some points.

One of the things I wanted to say was that you should take 3 things to help the world.
And then, once that becomes second nature to you, take 3 more things.
Etc.
Etc.
Etc.

Also, another thing that helps save the world is if you don't idle your car. I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the benefit to the earth are astronomical.
However, it's alot easier to follow that advice in California than in Canada.

Now, onto the comments!

Not shopping at Walmart while living in a town of 7000 that has a Walmart is harder than I thought. Everyone is always going to Walmart, and it's cheaper.

I didn't realize veal was injected with so much. Good to know. Of course, I don't want to know what anything I do eat is injected with.

I want to clear up my views on SUVs/Trucks. I won't own either. And I don't think anyone, except for the 0.1 percent of the population that's into off roading, should own an SUV. I don't feel the same about trucks.

However, I have problems with trucks. It's not that trucks are less fuel efficient than cars, it's that the laws were specifically created to allow trucks a loophole by which they wouldn't have to obey the fuel efficiency rulings. For that reason I think that governments need to close the truck loophole.
Similarly to SUVs, I'm opposed to people owning a truck that don't need it. If you have a farm and are constantly loading it up with shit, fine.
However, if you live in Richmond Hill, or even Edmonton, there is likely very little reason to own a truck. Even when it comes to moving shit around you might be surprised at how much a van with the seats out can hold. Obviously doesn't apply to moving topsoil, or rocks or whatever though.

Not littering and buying a fuel efficient car are good points. The other things are damn hard to do.
Although, I was in Edmonton, and none of the cars there have rust, and i was told it's because they don't salt the road.
Look at a map. Edmonton is frigging (yes, frigging) north. And they dont' use salt. Surely we can figure something out?